Friends with Escorts

[Guest regulation]

>As an escort with several years

>experience, I have been in

>such

>a situation many times.

 

I found your comments most interesting. It never ceases to amaze me how often clients confuse a performance with reality. It reminds me a bit of interviews I've read with soap opera stars in which they describe meeting fans who imagine that they have the same qualities as the characters they portray on television.

 

R.

[bluenix]

I find this idea of escort performance intriguing, but here's what I don't understand.

 

Service seems quite real. Even measurable. A waiter brings the soup while it's hot. Performance, on the other hand, being expressive, resists measurement, or at least objective measurement, and enters the realm of mimesis. But is it less real for being artificial, an imitation, like a play or a novel? Art brings us truth sometimes in ways 'reality' never can.

 

So the question becomes, in my mind, when does service turn into performance? It's that transitional zone that interests me.

 

(Okay, okay. Yes, I'm drinking, and a very nice Kim Crawford Sauvignon Blanc it is, too.)

 

g

[Guest cp8036]

Well put. The very nature of what is done in bed can confuse most anyone. Moreover, this is a guy you found attractive enough to pay to gain access. I think a good escort can give a lot of intimacy, seem like a lover, and a friend. But, he knows how to turn it off at the end of the session. Guess is all about boundries and compartmentalizing.

 

I am actually fascinated if an escort can sucessfully turn on the passion/romance/affection, but then easily and tactfully return to a business relation once the clothes are back on. It must be hard to start and stop like a water faucet. To do constantly must be a pressure and hard to manage. Guys have told me about the stalkers, IM freaks, cards, gifts, and so on.

 

A client that is overly obsessed, or lonely, can easily get confused by a good escort that gives himself emtionally, physical, and sexually. Both sides need to be realistic, and be aware of the temporary nature of the love and friendship, like one hour. Outside the session, both should be polite and professional if happened upon, as one would be if seen your plumber or denist in the street. But, that analogy is bit strained, as we don't deepthroat and fuck our dentist... (might try with the plumber though).

 

If you happen to establish relationship beyond escort/client, you still need to step back and consider if is really a friendship, or is it manipulation. Perhaps the escort is seeming to be a friend, but if he is constantly asking for a little help with car insurance, cell phone bill, etc, the relation is not geniune. Likewise, if the client thinks the friendship will lead to free sex, or romantic walks on the beach, he is misguided.

 

A mature client and/or escort will not allow to happen. A bad escort/hustler may befriend, but steal out the backdoor. The poor client is just getting set up for disappointment.

 

Sex is ideally done between two people who genuinely love or lust or like each other. Escort situation coupled you only for reasons of financial gain of one side, and convenience for the other. Get real, don't have false hopes, and dont give false hope.

[MiamiLooker]

>And that's why it's such a

>damned shame that HooBoy had

>to close the private Escort

>conference here and why none

>of us should be surprised

>by the contents of the

>purloined thread. I hope

>that he finds a way

>to reopen it soon.

 

I'm not all that puter literate, but posting on the internet doesn't guarantee privacy or security, even to a "private" site, especially if one is using an easily identifiable member name. Escorting does not require an oath of ethics....

[Guest bluboy]

This is an emotionally very dangerous game and I think you should keeps your wits about you and assume that the freindship is not real. Thes best escorts are masters of illusion- afterall that is what they are being paid for. I am friends with someone whom we share the same escort and my friend swears that the guy is his friend and how they have created a special bond and how he talks to him about his family etc. and how he cancelled appointments to spend time with him. But every episode and every story that my friend tells me about his time with this escort, the escort uses the exact same lines with me and it comes off really sincere and in a way it is sincere in the moment. "I feel different with you" "I love your smile" "Deep down I feel a kind of connection." and by the way I have laughed and told my friend to come on and that he uses those lines with me too but he does not want to hear. He is complicit in the drama. By the way this guy calls me to go to movies for free and hang out etc but I ran my own experiment and said you know what the friendship and the professional thing are getting in the way lets just be friends. Then he tried to seduce me many times and I just refused to sleep with him on the grounds that we were friends. Then he just stopped calling. The friendship was not enough. About 6 months later I was horny for him and called. He came "I have really missed you" I smiled and got down on my knees. Now our relationship is strictly professional. Do you want to test the boundaries of the friendship? Take out the professional for 6 months and get your jollies elsewhere! If the guy is still hanging around even though no cash/ or free Hamptons house time has exchanged hands, then you maybe friends. But come on people wake up and smell the cappuccino! Or just admit to yourself you are fine with the illusion and that is great!

[MiamiLooker]

Can the friendship be maintained without the sex? Would you want to?

[Bilbo]

Dick - Thanks

 

Miami - a code of ethics may not be required per se, but isn't that what a lot of this site is about - enforcing the assumed code of ethics?

[Bilbo]

Most gay men, no matter what their history, might not keep dating you after about three dates if there is no sex involved yet. And several friends have told me that they tried live in relationships where for some reason their other half has cut them off from the sex after only a week or a month. The most loyal of these, even living together, only kept the relationship going for another year and a half.

 

One thing that has been striking me, and one or two other guys here have been starting to touch on it, is that most of the people who have been talking about their friendships with escorts have been talking about how the escort would include them into their life, introduce them to their friends, etc. and not about the client including the escort into his life and introducing them to their friends, etc. True friendship is a two way street. I, myself, had a regular client whom I was seeing once or twice a week soon after my fourth husband died. I made the mistake of trying to turn him into a boyfriend or maybe even a lover and came up on the wall that one reason he was paying for it was that he just wasn't ready for a gay relationship.

[Guest LG320126]

<One thing that has been striking me, and one or two other guys here have been starting to touch on it, is that most of the people who have been talking about their friendships with escorts have been talking about how the escort would include them into their life, introduce them to their friends, etc. and not about the client including the escort into his life and introducing them to their friends, etc.>

 

 

Point well taken, but in my case where I am married and have kids of my own, I really don't think it would be a great idea to take my escort/friend home to meet the family. I do, however, have some gay friends here locally and the escort that I also refer to as my friend will be meeting them when he comes to visit me next month on my turf. He has some appointments in the area and has made plans to be with me (as friends) while he is here. Already have a couple days planned with him and personal friends, so now he will have met some of my friends as well as me having met his friends and family. Not tring to beat a dead horse, and if I am naive and/or blind, forgive me, but I for one have an escort and a friend all in one.

 

P.S.

I do not pay for his services when we are together.

[Guest pickwick]

>Point well taken, but in my

>case where I am married

>and have kids of my

>own, I really don't think

>it would be a great

>idea to take my escort/friend

>home to meet the family.

> I do,

>however, have some gay friends

> here locally and the

>escort that I also refer

>to as my friend will

>be meeting them when he

>comes to visit me next

>month on my turf.

 

 

Sorry if this is off-topic, but I can't resist asking this in response to the personal information you volunteered. Why do you lead a double life?

[Barry]

The whole concept of an escort/friend has been one I've lived with for years now. First I agree with all those that have advised caution. Don't ask to be a friend. Friendships with non-escorts develop mutually over time. The client/escort business relationship adds additional baggage to that process. It must develop naturally, if at all. While I believe many escorts also have clients that they like and might want to be friends with, they also have to operate from a position of caution. They are human and can be hurt just as easily as we can.

 

Personally I had two escorts that I thought, over time, were my friends. "Friend" was a term they used first. In one case the friendship was clearly with my bank account. I was played for a fool and I performed the role most admirably. In the other case the jury is still out but I am feeling that my role in the sequel may just be worthy of a little statuette of some kind. In the second case thankfully it was my wallet and not my bank account.

 

Now on the positive side I count several escorts today as my friends. Again this developed over time. They all were the first to bring up the friendship. They have let me into their private lives and have not hesitated to be seen with me and introduce me to their friends. I certainly could be any of their fathers but taking me to a club and dancing in front of their friends has never been an issue with them. They have treated me to meals, drinks and inviting me out to just hang with them in a non-business role.

 

Is there still sex? Yes. Is it business? Yes. Do I pay if there is sex? Yes. On occasion I haven't paid but we follow a simple rule. If I want to play, I pay. If they want to play no payment is expected. The later doesn't happen often but that's understandable. For those that think they are only doing the "friend" thing to insure a regular arrangement...well I wondered the same thing. But in each case what I pay is so disproportionate to the amount of time we spend together. And we hang out and do things without play or pay. They certainly aren't making money on me. We have fun.

 

One major caution when and if you do develop a friendship with an escort. You get to see them in all their human glory. As with any friend you see them when they are bitchy, moody, angry, depressed etc. I just spent an extended vacation with one of my escort/friends and trust me. We really got on each others nerves a few times. The same would happen with any two people. Also when together as friends, be prepared for the guy to drewl over and make comments about the hotties around you. They are not on the clock and there is no place for jealousy. The "illusion" of you being their lover, BF or date is not there. You are there as a friend so look around at the hotties and do some drewling yourself.

 

Just my humble little sack of advice built on some bruises and some smiles.

 

Good luck, DVS

[Guest Tampa Yankee]

This is an interesting thread with a number of interesting comments. I am glad to see ChicagoCorey entering the discussion with an escort's perspective:

 

>This is definitely true -- but

>many people are apprehensive or

>unwilling or just plain don't

>want to be friends with

>the "boss" -- which, unfortunately,

>is how many escorts feel

>towards most of their clients.

 

an interesting and insightful perspective from the other side.

 

>Friendships can develop but it

>takes time, patience, and honesty

>from all sides.

 

Short of extraordinary circumstances, is there any other way?

 

and deej... I am in total agreement with you:

 

>I guess that's where I differ.

>I've never felt the escort/client

>relationship was boss/employee.

>I may be paying for sex but

>I'm not buying a damn slave!

 

One of the surprises for me in some of the responses is the measure of premeditation present to make someone a friend or to ascertain if they are a friend... If you have to do either there probably is no significant friendship. Friendship at various levels manifests itself of its own accord, in small ways over time. Although a potential for friendship may exist, trying to prompt it is dangerous as Reg points out:

 

>Whenever you try to take your

>relationship with anyone, escort

>or not, to a new level you risk rejection.

 

A second surprise to me is the ‘expectation’ that ‘friends’ should be that deeply into each other’s lives – for me that is reserved for the best of friends which is a very exclusive club (not by design, just the way it works out). I expect nothing different from anyone else. There are different levels of friendship with business associates, professionals, neighbors, and others. The limits of a friendship are more or less proportional to the intersection of the lives and interests of the individuals. With escorts who may be considerably younger (certainly in my case) that intersection is obviously narrow. So one accepts what the friendship has to offer and contributes accordingly -– no demands, no expectations, que sera, sera.

 

The only reason to force the friendship issue at all, it seems to me, has to do with an emotional need or worse, it influencing some life decision. If this is the case look out... because you are venturing into the quicksand of emotional relationships that goes well beyond most friendships IMHO. If that is where one wants to go OK, just have your eyes open and be prepared for all eventualities. It is dangerous ground as pointed out by Blu.

 

And if you find yourself becoming friends with an escort, don't confuse the escort/client relationship with the friendship, as I think bigjoey pointed out. It raises a cloud of motive, which is death to a friendship. The client invariably schedules with the escort, friends or not -- remember that you have engaged him during his work time in a work scene. If this is not a work related event then he will make it clear -- it is his perogative and his alone. Your assumption otherwise will raise the spectre of motive, even if there is none. If he initiates the friendly get-together then assume it's just that and not a sex encounter, again that is his move to make and his alone. Otherwise the question of motive comes to the fore once again. You wouldn't tell your friend the attorney that you assume there will be no charge for his services because of your friendship, would you? If so, I think it would happen only once.

[Guest LG320126]

Your question is very complex and personal but I will tell you that there would be both personal(family) and financial(work) ruin for me and others to jump the fence at this juncture in my life.

[Guest cp8036]

Very good point about the attorney friend. I have friend that is a MD. I never seek his medical services. To do so, would create a conflict. If he a made a medical mistake, the friendship would certainly be impacted. "You accidently took out the wrong kidney, but don't worry, we can still be good friends."

 

I tell salespeople in the field they cannot consider a client a true friend either. If the sales were to stop, I think would be some impact on the friendship.

 

Perhaps the pairs of client/escort, client salesperson can go from professional relationship to friendship. But, doubtful can happen concurrently.

[Guest pickwick]

This is not an issue that has ever come up for me. I have so little in common with the escorts I've seen that I don't see how it would be possible for us to have another sort of relationship even if I wanted to. For me the whole point of hiring escorts is to have sex with men who I wouldn't otherwise meet socially due to age and other differences. Friendship seems to be a possibility for the thread author because he's dealing with an escort who is close to his own age, but that's not the case for most of us.

[Guest LG320126]

Pick, without sounding condescending, the thread is not about seeing how many of us can run out and become good friends with escorts. To me, the question at hand is whether it is possible to become good friends with an escort, and in this particular post, what does everybody think about it.

 

I am a good friend with 1 escort, and although I have seen others, I have no desire to become close friends with them, although by no means their enemy either. The relationship with the 1 escort that I mention has just evolved naturally, it wasn't planned and I certainly didn't make a concerted effort to go find an escort half my age and ask him to be my friend. I am just a firm believer, and in the minority I guess, that it is possible for an escort and a client to become good friends - no more, no less.

[MiamiLooker]

>Dick - Thanks

>

>Miami - a code of ethics

>may not be required per

>se, but isn't that what

>a lot of this

>site is about - enforcing

>the assumed code of ethics?

>

 

 

OK I'll do what I can to help enforce it.

 

TO BILLYBOY: You're a very naughty boy (shaking my finger as I say this).

 

There, that should teach him (and anyone else who might think about publicly posting confidential posts). Now everyone can be assured of confidentiality whenever they post.

[Guest LG320126]

Just what we needed!

[MiamiLooker]

>Most gay men, no matter what

>their history, might not keep

>dating you after about three

>dates if there is no

>sex involved yet. And several

>friends have told me that

>they tried live in relationships

>where for some reason their

>other half has cut them

>off from the sex after

>only a week or a

>month. The most loyal of

>these, even living together, only

>kept the relationship going for

>another year and a half.

 

Maybe I misunderstood the original post, but I didn't take it to mean he was wanting to date the guy, but just to be friends.

 

My closest friend is about half my age, and I met him as his client three years ago. I think I had maybe two "appointments" with him, and that was it. Since then, and I'm not sure how we even got to this point, but we've been friends; no sex. He sometimes sleeps over, either in the guest room or shares my bed, but I can't imagine having a sexual romp with him....the thought just seems incestual, plus, I have no interest in him that way. I've never thought of him as "my escort," he's just a friend.

[Guest pickwick]

>Pick, without sounding condescending, the thread

>is not about seeing how

>many of us can run

>out and become good friends

>with escorts. To me,

>the question at hand is

>whether it is possible to

>become good friends with an

>escort, and in this particular

>post, what does everybody think

>about it.

>

 

If you don't want to sound condescending then you shouldn't take it upon yourself to tell others what they should or shouldn't say. I read the original post in this thread. The author is interested in becoming friends with an escort he has been seeing and wants to know what others think of this idea. My comment is that the author's situation is unusual in a way that may make it more likely that he will be able to do this than would be the case for most clients. Is there something about that comment that you don't understand or find objectionable? If not, kindly concede that I have the right to make it, as I believe I do.

[Guest LG320126]

<If not, kindly concede that I have the right to make it, as I believe I do.>

 

Pick, consider it conceded. My comment was not meant to be confrontational, there is enough of that in here without me starting anything. Sorry if you took it that way.

[Guest DVS]

>This is not an issue that

>has ever come up for

>me. I have so

>little in common with the

>escorts I've seen that I

>don't see how it would

>be possible for us to

>have another sort of relationship

>even if I wanted to.

> For me the whole

>point of hiring escorts is

>to have sex with men

>who I wouldn't otherwise meet

>socially due to age and

>other differences. Friendship seems

>to be a possibility for

>the thread author because he's

>dealing with an escort who

>is close to his own

>age, but that's not the

>case for most of us.

 

 

You are correct! I value everyone's opinions and comments here. Here is an update I spent yesterday night with the escort mentioned in my thread and I still felt the friendship thing approaching in my mind.

 

I guess what the clincher is that this guy spent more time with me off the clock to talk and get to know each other. My tongue was so on fire but I treaded very carefully and let sleeping dogs lie. I do feel emotional connected but on a friendship level not bf or lover. I did not take the conversation to that lever though.

 

Yes I like the guy sexually if being friends meant giving up the sex part that would be fine. I really like people and since I don't have a stock of gay friends in my life I am willing to go the extra mile to acquire friends I like and appear to like me. With that statement said how do you know if they really like you or if they are going home with a Emmy! I do believe time will tell as has been said here by the majority.

 

Is there anything I can do to send the friend vibe without the stalker, lover, bf want-to-be, free rider syndrome sneaking it's ugly head out?

 

But to complicate the matter I am a tipper which I know is currently on fire in another thread. This could very well for discussion purposes be the extended friendship I am feeling. However I do not feel this is the case. This guy knows I am well off and has never eluded to any suggestion of monetary gain nor proposition.

 

Also I have never asked anyone in the past to be my friend whereas it was acquired with time. But, this is again a different scenario since if I meet someone and want to be friends with them I can call them right up and ask if they want to do something. However if you call an escort the purpose could be distorted if the intentions are not spelled out and then it may seem like you want a free ride.

 

If you keep hiring them they may be afraid to approach the subject based on losing a client which is why I am here seeking insight and experience. I have gained a lot here and a few laughs along the way.

 

You guys are Great! Hey you guys want to be friends?

[Guest pickwick]

>Also I have never asked anyone

>in the past to be

>my friend whereas it was

>acquired with time. But, this

>is again a different scenario

>since if I meet someone

>and want to be friends

>with them I can call

>them right up and ask

>if they want to do

>something. However if you call

>an escort the purpose could

>be distorted if the intentions

>are not spelled out and

>then it may seem like

>you want a free ride.

>

>

 

That is true, but you have to start somewhere. If I were in your position, I would think about things discussed with the escort -- favorite films, bands or clubs, for example -- that suggest things you could do together. At the next opportunity, I would say "By the way, I was thinking of going to [film, concert, club, etc.], would you be interested in going?" His answer will tell you a lot about whether there is a real possibility of having a social relationship.

[Guest Italotraveler]

I have become very friendly with two escorts and both friendships were initiated by them. In one case, the escort called me and said he was going to a movie and asked if I wanted to go along...he knew I was in town on business alone. Skeptical, I said, "How much will it cost to be with you for the evening." He laughed and told me he liked me and knew I was alone for the week so he thought I'd enjoy going out for the evening...no charge, "just as friends." That started a really wonderful friendship. I've stayed with him when I've been in town and we've have some really nice times together. In the other case, the escort called me "just to talk." I was a little surprised and again was wondering what this was all about. Turned out to be nothing more than his wanting to talk..mostly about a personal situation. Since then he calls me when he comes to town to dance and we go out to dinner or lunch. And often he calls me or I call him "just to talk". Again, a really nice relationship has developed. In both cases we are no longer client-escort and the time we spend together is purely casual and friendly...well, most of the time :-) I don't think these kinds of relationships are the norm, but they can happen...I guess it depends on the chemistry between the people and how they treat each other from the initial meeting.

[Guest Tampa Yankee]

I was reading my earlier post (it was a slow day and I stumbled over it as I was catching up on the latest posts to this thread) and when I got to the following:

 

for me that is reserved for the best of friends which is a very exclusive club (not by design, just the way it works out).

 

I thought ‘what an asshole’ this guy is :-(... not my best attempt at communicating my thought. What I wanted to say -– my close friends have always been few in number mostly going back to college days (not a club and certainly not exclusive). This circumstance is not by design, just the way things worked out and probably says more about me than others. (I am sure this latter point can be appreciated now.)

 

Another brief comment… I believe ‘client and friend’ usually is an easier issue that ‘client or friend’.

 

Now, I’m off to my ‘writing for clarity of expression’ class. :-(